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truthaction.org 9/11 TRUTH NOW
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truthmover

Joined: 19 Oct 2007 Posts: 1550 Location: Los Angeles
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Posted: Sun Apr 06, 2008 12:38 am Post subject: The Shell Game & Week of Truth - A critical view |
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This is Julian from TruthMove. Many weeks ago I was offered an advanced copy of "The Shell Game." I had heard it was good talking to a prominent member of the movement whom I respect.
That got me looking into the author. What I found out did not make me very enthusiastic, and I expressed those concerns. My biggest concern at the time was this:
http://www.truthmove.org/forum/topic/985?replies=15#post-5601
So I asked for a copy of the book and read it cover to cover. After having read the book I was at first somewhat charmed by reading fiction that dealt with many of the themes I am so close to. However, after a week of thinking more about it, I came to realize that I had many problems with the book. I offered a review of the book and had an interesting discussion about it here:
http://www.truthmove.org/forum/topic/882?replies=32
Then a few weeks later I received an e-mail message that Steve Alten sent out asking for support. The message contained many inaccurate, misleading, and even false statements. I expressed my concerns here:
http://www.truthmove.org/forum/topic/905?replies=4
I thought this was all over with, and that the book had run its course, when I found out about the "Week of Truth." I found many statements made on the website highly divisive and disrespectful. I felt fed up. I responded here:
http://www.truthmove.org/forum/topic/985?replies=15
I suppose that all this makes me one of the most vocal skeptics of the benefit of the book and its promotion. But I certainly have not been alone in expressing distaste with the book or concerns about how it is being promoted. I have tried in all my statements to remain level headed and as fair as I could be, offering the benefit of the doubt wherever possible.
I post this here now as I feel that with so many prominent people behind this promotion that it has now become more difficult for people to express concerns or reservations that they may feel about how this is all going down. I feel that it is very important that we not feel a sense of group think or bandwagon effect taking hold in this matter.
In case you do not read anything from the links I have provided, I have made it clear that many of those who support the book and its promotion are people that I highly respect. However it is for that very reason that it has been challenging for myself and others to express our concerns.
I hope to open a constructive dialog about this matter. I encourage everyone to do your very best to stick to facts and logical critique as there is a strong potential for disagreement. |
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Scott N

Joined: 24 Jul 2007 Posts: 1525
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Posted: Sun Apr 06, 2008 1:13 am Post subject: |
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http://www.stevealten.com
Glad to see people speaking out about this nonsense. |
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Art V
Joined: 02 Apr 2007 Posts: 219 Location: California
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Posted: Sun Apr 06, 2008 6:34 am Post subject: |
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Truthmover-
Thanks for the write up. I read all the posts at the truth move forum. I was not aware of the list endorsing the book, and my feelings were exactly in line with yours (in reference to the Bevin Karret quote). Is it possible that Alten was a horror story author, ignorant to 9/11 truth, and then decided to use his talents to make a 9/11 novel to promote the truth?
The fact that he is making the most money during the week of truth is a cause for concern. I have not read the book and have heard mixed opinions about it. I don't rally want to read any fiction. Only the facts for me.
In addition I have learned in a short time that the bandwagon effect in the truth movement is very dangerous.
Most of all I simply liked the post and the commentary. I feel that you were respectable, admitting you could be wrong, but cautious at the same time.
I guess we will just have to see what the end result is. |
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truthmover

Joined: 19 Oct 2007 Posts: 1550 Location: Los Angeles
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Posted: Sun Apr 06, 2008 3:48 pm Post subject: |
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ArtV, that's a really awesome response. I really appreciate that you noticed my sincere if imperfect attempt to present this in an open way. I know that I can't make up people's minds for them. But some of what's in front of us just doesn't look kosher to me and others, and I am very surprised that so few people have expressed a similar concern. That's what has motivated my expression of concern about this book and its promotion.
Few people in a movement of critical thinkers would like to admit that they are ever subject to group think or on a bandwagon. And yet that potential is real. When I see so many red flags and then hear that so many people I have respected for their critical thinking haven't noticed or decided to ignore them, I get really concerned.
I've noticed that people who disagree with the issues myself and others have raised tend to defend the quality of the book while ignoring the serious problems with the manner in which it is being promoted. And that doesn't feel all too prudent coming from people who spend a great deal of time considering how to best promote something.
The fact is, many people have been willing to express their opinion that the book isn't very good. That might signify that its not going to be a #1 hit, but its also not really the reason why I've been pressing this issue.
| Quote: | | Is it possible that Alten was a horror story author, ignorant to 9/11 truth, and then decided to use his talents to make a 9/11 novel to promote the truth? |
Could go either way on that one. See this link from above:
http://www.truthmove.org/forum/topic/985?replies=15#post-5601
I'm not entirely sure how much to fault Alten in all this. He may just be someone who has been taken advantage of by opportunists in the movement who sold him on this promotional agenda. Or he may be an opportunist himself, knowing that he could hijack our concern to get his book sold and make a buck. He seems to have done that to people who are interested in the Lochness monster, so we can't put it past him. But I also would be hesitant to suggest that he has no real concern for 9/11 truth.
Whatever the case, good or bad author, good or bad book, the manner in which the book is being promoted and the prominent people who seem not to have noticed are the primary basis for my having continued to address this issue.
I still think this could all blow over without a major fiasco. But that won't mean I'm still not concerned about why all those prominent truthers were willing to be associated with a promotional effort that was insulting and divisive for many others. |
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truebeleaguer
Joined: 13 Mar 2008 Posts: 654
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Posted: Sun Apr 06, 2008 3:58 pm Post subject: |
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Dubbing as "Truth Week" an obvious astro-turf effort to game the best-seller
system and sell fiction seems a tactic to inspire ridicule. |
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truthmover

Joined: 19 Oct 2007 Posts: 1550 Location: Los Angeles
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Posted: Mon Apr 07, 2008 12:23 am Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | Dubbing as "Truth Week" an obvious astro-turf effort to game the best-seller system and sell fiction seems a tactic to inspire ridicule. |
Yeah, I think "Week of Truth" is a very poor choice. Might be a good name for a week long international action for truth. Maybe a yearly week during which we reflect on the future goals and past accomplishments of the movement.
Here's the bottom line. This whole thing has shown a potential to divide us. And it's not people who don't like the book or its promotion who are doing the dividing.
It's people saying that those who do not support it are "naive."
It's people saying that this is the single most important moment in the movement's history.
It's people who are making false or exaggerated claims about the potential for this book to benefit the movement.
It's people who are promoting the involvement of others without their permission.
And it's people who are ignoring or excusing all these very explicit problems knowing full well that they are causing confusion, frustration, and hard feelings for many in the movement.
I wish Steve Alten all the best. I hope he sells his book and does well for himself. I think that by itself the book will encourage some people to look further into some of the issues it addresses. I hope that benefits the movement.
But the perceived opportunity this represents seems to be bringing the worst out of some people, like a crowd scrambling after money that someone has strewn on the ground, and I hope very much that people involved will be a bit more critical about how this is going down. |
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Art V
Joined: 02 Apr 2007 Posts: 219 Location: California
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Posted: Mon Apr 07, 2008 4:35 pm Post subject: |
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Taken off 911truth.org
ichard Gage; Architects and Engineers for 9/11 Truth
- Kevin Ryan; former Underwriter Labs manager/whisteblower
- Professor Steven Jones; Scholars for 911 Truth & Justice Founder
- Paul Craig Roberts; Past editor Wall Street Journal/Columnist for The National Review)
- Peter Phillips; Director of Project Censored
- Dylan Avery; Producer/Director “Loose Change – The Final Cut”
- Bob McIlvaine; Father of Bobby – Fighter for 9/11 Truth
- Daniel Sunjata; Star of “Rescue Me” TV Series – 9/11 activist
- Luke Rudkowski; A Founding Member of WeAreChange
- Jack Blood; Radio Host Who Challenged Tim Russert on 9/11 Questions
- Kyle Hence; 9/11 Press for Truth Director/Citizen’s Watch Founder
- Carol Brouillet; Organizer of 1st National 911 Truth Conference in San Francisco
- Cosmos; Founder of TruthAction.org
- Janice Matthews; Director of 911Truth.org
- Jarek Kupsc; Director of the film “Reflecting Pool”
- Jon Gold; 911Blogger Columnist
- Jonathan Mark; FlyByNews
- Ken Jenkins; Co-Organizer of the 1st National 9/11 Truth Conference/Filmmaker
- Les Jamieson; New York 9/11 Founding Activist
- Michael Jackman; Student Scholars for 9/11 Truth Founding Member
- Michael Wolsey; Visibility911.com Founder
- Mark Peters; Student Scholars for 9/11 Truth Founding Member
- Justin Martell; Student Scholars for 9/11 Truth Founding Member
- Mike Berger; 911Truth.org Media–Spoke to America on CNN in March, 2006
- Paul Deslauriers; 911truth.org grassroots coordinator
- Paul Krik, Filmmaker, "Able Danger: The Movie"
- Peter Garritano; Vermont911 Founding Member
- Reprehensor; 911Blogger.com
this is a very comprehensive list....maybe this is a good idea...Cosmos, would you like to add some commentary? |
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Scott N

Joined: 24 Jul 2007 Posts: 1525
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Posted: Mon Apr 07, 2008 4:44 pm Post subject: |
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Actor Daniel Sunjata blogged the following in support of the Shell Game Truth week:
"Forgive me if in the process I end up repeating or restating things which you may feel I had already made sufficiently clear. First off, I want to say how much I admire the critical and independent thinking that is so prevalent amongst the 9/11 Truth community. It should not come as a surprise, since in the absence of such critical analysis and thought, all of us would still be hoodwinked by the official myth.
This is, therefore, one of our greatest strengths. But in my opinion it can also be a tragic flaw. Let me clarify... Many of you have been at this much longer than I, but as a relative newbie, it has been my perception that our movement's biggest weakness is our divided, fractionalized, schismatic lack of unity in general.
While it is a definite plus to have this "leaderless resistance" waged on many fronts and according to varied methodologies, this particular approach to the info war leaves us oft-times disconnected and isolated by our differences in tactics."
I posted about the 11th Day Actions in response and encourage you to do the same:
http://911blogger.com/node/14807#comment-182108 |
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truthmover

Joined: 19 Oct 2007 Posts: 1550 Location: Los Angeles
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Posted: Mon Apr 07, 2008 4:52 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | This group that met late on that Monday evening, were in the tradition of Jefferson, John & Abigail Adams, Franklin. For in my opinion these modern heroes are our modern equivalent of such figures. As I sat in on this historic conference, the names announcing and coming together, many meeting one another for the first time although their historic work preceded them, was indeed profound. I listened as attendees introduced themselves, knowing of the great work they had done. |
http://www.911truth.org/article.php?story=20080404144812511 |
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Art V
Joined: 02 Apr 2007 Posts: 219 Location: California
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Posted: Mon Apr 07, 2008 5:06 pm Post subject: |
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I posted too...
Why isn't Cosmos listed on that list Sunjata posted on his blog?
taken from Sunjata's post at blogger
Richard Gage; Architects and Engineers for 9/11 Truth
- David Ray Griffin, Professor Emeritus, Author, 9/11 Truth Advocate
- Kevin Ryan; former Underwriter Labs manager/whisteblower
- Professor Steven Jones; Scholars for 911 Truth & Justice Founder
- Paul Craig Roberts; Past editor Wall Street Journal/Columnist for The National Review)
- Peter Phillips; Director of Project Censored
- Dylan Avery; Producer/Director "Loose Change – The Final Cut"
- Bob McIlvaine; Father of Bobby – Fighter for 9/11 Truth
- Luke Rudkowski; A Founding Member of WeAreChange
- Jack Blood; Radio Host Who Challenged Tim Russert on 9/11 Questions
- Kyle Hence; 9/11 Press for Truth Director/Citizen's Watch Founder
- Carol Brouillet; Organizer of 1st National 911 Truth Conference in San Francisco
- Janice Matthews; Director of 911Truth.org
- Jarek Kupsc; Director of the film "Reflecting Pool"
- Jon Gold; 911Blogger Columnist
- Jonathan Mark; FlyByNews
- Ken Jenkins; Co-Organizer of the 1st National 9/11 Truth Conference/Filmmaker
- Les Jamieson; New York 9/11 Founding Activist
- Michael Jackman; Student Scholars for 9/11 Truth Founding Member
- Michael Wolsey; Visibility911.com Founder
- Mark Peters; Student Scholars for 9/11 Truth Founding Member
- Justin Martell; Student Scholars for 9/11 Truth Founding Member
- Mike Berger; 911Truth.org Media–Spoke to America on CNN in March, 2006
- Paul Deslauriers; 911truth.org grassroots coordinator
- Paul Krik, Filmmaker, "Able Danger: The Movie"
- Peter Garritano; Vermont911 Founding Member
- Reprehensor; 911Blogger.com |
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YT
Joined: 18 Jan 2007 Posts: 4601 Location: California
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Posted: Mon Apr 07, 2008 6:20 pm Post subject: |
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| Art V wrote: | | this is a very comprehensive list....maybe this is a good idea...Cosmos, would you like to add some commentary? |
Ummm.... OK, but I'm going to have to keep it brief or else I will fill up pages and pages...
First, thanks to Julian for speaking up about his concerns and also to John Wright who has done the same over at blogger. It can be a difficult thing to do when the bandwagon is whipping along at full speed and when even very respectfully stated dissent is discouraged or outright attacked. I have some fairly serious issues with the book itself but my main concern has been the manner in which it has been promoted within the movement. I could go on at length about it but Julian has done a good job of summarizing.
I was not involved in that conference call and my name has been removed from updated versions of the list, at my request.
Also, not everyone on that list endorses the book... just ask Luke.
This is not to detract from the campaign - it's just the facts.
Hopefully we will make it through this first "Week of Truth" without the Loch Ness monster rearing its head and with everyone's best intentions being realized and then we can move on and do something else for the second one...
Reprehensor is soliciting ideas for week 2.0 here. |
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Art V
Joined: 02 Apr 2007 Posts: 219 Location: California
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Posted: Mon Apr 07, 2008 7:55 pm Post subject: |
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Thanks for the reply. Very well written and clears a lot up for me.
| YT wrote: |
Hopefully we will make it through this first "Week of Truth" without the Loch Ness monster rearing its head and with everyone's best intentions being realized and then we can move on and do something else for the second one.. |
Clever.
I look forward to week two as well. |
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truthmover

Joined: 19 Oct 2007 Posts: 1550 Location: Los Angeles
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Posted: Mon Apr 07, 2008 11:40 pm Post subject: |
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I haven't seen this posted here on the TruthAction forum or over at 911Blogger. The following opinion piece is one the primary reasons why myself and others have been so concerned about how the "Week of Truth" is being promoted and who is coordinating the effort.
"Naivete is Killing the 9/11 Truth Movement's Hope for Media Breakthrough!"
http://www.opednews.com/articles/opedne_bill_dou_080312_naivete_is_killing_t.htm
| Quote: | | Naivete among those newer to 9/11 truth is crushing the life from the lungs of hope for our movement breaking through the media blockade. |
| Quote: | However, from the beginning, as always happens when a big breakthrough is about to occur for 9/11 truth . . . “The Shell Game” came under attack. The old familiar attacks:
* It didn’t blame the Jews enough
* It was anti-Moslem and blamed it on Arabs [not true, as The Shell Game’s false flag event was conducted out of the White House. The Muslims were only patsies.]
* It didn’t go far enough
* It didn’t get into space weapon beams blowing up the Towers
* It wasn’t this
* or It wasn’t that |
| Quote: | | From my years of 9/11 action, I’m convinced that most of the attacks on all of us, have begun with infiltrators in the movement...However, the infiltrators are not the problem. The problem lies in the naivete of 9/11 truth seekers . . . who believe the planted smears that always come out at real 9/11 truth breakthroughs. |
These statements grossly stereotype those who are critical of the manner in which the book is being promoted as either ignorant, biased, or paid.
I do not find these statements to be appropriate and specifically coming from someone who is coordinating this project, and is calling themselves an "activist leader."
I believe that if Bill Douglas is sincerely interested in creating a coalition around this promotional effort that he has a responsibility to offer an apology for this statement and others that he has made. |
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Col. Jenny Sparks

Joined: 15 Aug 2007 Posts: 2329
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Posted: Tue Apr 08, 2008 1:00 am Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | I do not find these statements to be appropriate and specifically coming from someone who is coordinating this project, and is calling themselves an "activist leader." |
I agree that self proclaimed "leader" bit put me right off. If he'd just stuck to "long time activist"--which while technically true is a stretch considering he's been out of the loop awhile--it wouldn't be a problem.
Since no one on this side is going to buy that bollox, all I can think of is someone(not necessarily Douglas) wants him to be perceived as a leader. I'm telling you, looks like a "straw man" set up...
Another thing--I might have said this already--from go the No planes wankers were slagging this. Almost from before go. As soon as Douglass started spamming forums/sites/groups BAM! The noplaners were all over how this was a horrible disinfo op, etc., etc. They were all on the same page.
From go. Now as far as I can tell only select people had advanced copies of the book. So how the hell did Webfairy, Saigirl, Benoyes, etc, etc, get access to the book to know enough about it so they could trash it almost before it hit the stands?
In a parallel, the Zihopers, while not as quick , were also all over it.
Hmm, I'm not a Noplaner, I'm not a Zihopper, both of whom hate the book, so I'm going to support it.
Is that how that was supposed to work?
| Quote: | * It didn’t blame the Jews enough
* It was anti-Moslem and blamed it on Arabs
* It didn’t get into space weapon beams blowing up the Towers |
Why is he even bringing "space beams" as if the lack of them might be a valid criticism?
| Quote: |
If 9/11 truth activists can be less naďve about believing the smear campaigns that infiltrators spread through the movement . . . and pay attention to what the seasoned movement researchers and activist leaders have to share with them . . . we could do something historic together.
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| Quote: | Why? Because the webmasters and leaders of these organizations are being hit with many attacks, when they back “The Shell Game”. You can count on it. Why? Because the powers that be know that “The Shell Game”s stealth ability to break through the media blockade is one of the biggest threats they face.
From my years of 9/11 action, I’m convinced that most of the attacks on all of us, have begun with infiltrators in the movement. |
If I have criticism about your promotional style, I'm an infiltrator?
I've an idea--how bout you go [expletive deleted] yourself?
No--This. Is. Not. On.
I don't care what the brainless "no planers" say. I don't care what the "Zihop-only Israel did 911"--prats say. These people saying "X" will not make me say "Y" just to prove I'm not an infiltrator. Or not "naive".
The fact is the promotion is manipulative and divisive. Period. So stop it, please.
 _________________ ___________________________________________________
http://coljennysparks.blogspot.com/ |
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Col. Jenny Sparks

Joined: 15 Aug 2007 Posts: 2329
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Posted: Tue Apr 08, 2008 1:17 am Post subject: |
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I forgot to mention in the thread truthmover linked to where one of the people criticizing Douglas in the comments does so like this:
| Quote: | Bill Cain
Naivete
If you really want to understand why 9-11 Truth can't break into the mainstream, I suggest you take the time to study the last 60 years of the UFO Disclosure movement, because not understanding that, and expecting one book to turn the 9-11 Truth trick is real NAIVETE.
by Bill Cain (2 articles, 0 quicklinks, 207 comments) on Friday, March 14, 2008 at 8:05:17 PM
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This after "space beams" CB Brooklyn popped up for the first comment.
No, I'm not going to change my mind just because a UFO person happens to be taking the same stance(for entirely different reasons). But I am wondering how the noplaner and UFO person got there before anyone sane.
Perhaps because of indiscriminate, incompetent promotion on noplanes/conspiracy forums?
 _________________ ___________________________________________________
http://coljennysparks.blogspot.com/ |
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